All right, people. Get yourselves situated cuz we’re going off the racing line. It’s the run to the line. Workman’s off the track. He’s got all four Michelin over the white line. He’s defending off the racing line. Welcome back to Off the Racing Line. I am your host, Carlos Spitia, and joining me as always is Mike Moore. Mike, welcome back, buddy. Thank you, sir. Always my pleasure to uh be here. Thanks for having me back again. Hey, Mike. Uh, picture this. A BMW race car crashing hard at Daytona. He strokes slamming the driver into a dizzy mess as he fights to hold on to consciousness. Our guest today was just a college kid from New York who didn’t care about cars, then got obsessed with them. Then he got hooked on racing. Now he’s racing in Far WRL and also laughing his ass off while he takes on kids fresh from carding and into Formula 4. His story is perfect for Off the Racing Line. How Gold, Welcome to the show, man. It’s my pleasure. I love the narration. This You like the introduction? Yeah, that’s fantastic. That’s probably the only thing that I really work on like before every episode. That’s great. I mean, I hear it in my head. I I love that. That’s great. Chadi wanted me uh wanted to hire me to do his intro every time we he went somewhere. I think I might hire you to be in the car with me narrating turn by turn what I’m doing, making me feel like I’m in the movies, you know? Yeah. Maybe we can reach out to the people at Garmin and have the catalyst voice like Carlos recorded. That would be great. There you go. As long as there’s some royalties there, I’m all for it. Um, let’s get started with your story into motorsports. Yeah. You told me a little bit about it. You mentioned that um as even into your teens, you had no care or interest in cars. Yeah. No. Born and raised Well, New York City kid. Um, the only thing we knew about cars were the yellow ones don’t stop. Um, which we unfortunately, you know, we were kids in New York. rollerblading, skateboarding, all that kind of stuff. Got hit by a few cabs. That was all we knew about. Um, never no one was interested in driving. We were just uh, you know, city kids, just subway, taxis, all that. Went to college. Um, still I was driving my grandmother’s uh, 1984 Honda Accord, which I loved because it worked. It was a car. It got me places. Um, and uh, my buddy who is marginally into cars, more into the show of, you know, he wanted to get girls, he wanted to go to the clubs. He leased a BMW 3 series, just standard 3 series. Um, I know anything about cars. And he was like, “Let me show you what this thing’s about.” I’m like, “Okay, it’s a nice car. It’s German car. Cool.” Um, we went in the back roads of, uh, Garden City, New York. It’s not much back roads, but, you know, tearing through the streets. um car never missed a beat, never chirped the tire, and just took speeds at, you know, things I didn’t think possible. My my Honda Accord couldn’t certainly do that. Um and that was kind of the first spark of like, whoa, like that was kind of interesting, you know, that was kind of fun. Um and then coincidentally, uh the Fast and Furious franchise started and I saw the first film and I was like, this is so wild. What is this niche culture? Like what is this stuff? Yeah. Um, and I think just started taking note of tuner cars, um, people customizing their Mustangs or whatnot. And I was like, “Wow, this is really cool.” Um, you know, I want to know more about that, you know, I want to kind of see what that scene’s about. And, uh, you know, I think then the E46 M3 came out and I was just like, what is this? You know, and you’re still living in New York. Still living in New York. I still don’t have a budget for anything beyond my Honda Accord, which was still working. And uh but you’re all nine doing research. Oh man, I mean, you know, YouTube, you know, was really coming to its own then. Uh this was 2000 2001. Um and I would just sit and just watch exhaust videos. Just the coolest exhaust videos I could watch, you know, and I was just like, I I need this in my life, you know, just these these these symphonies of just burbles and pops and whatnot. Um I don’t think burbles were back then. They weren’t. They were. Well, you know, the C63 if you modified it, it could have some liftoff burbling, but because I had one that’s I know, but uh it wasn’t it wasn’t what it is today with burble tunes. Um but yeah, that was my gateway drug. And then uh you know, from that I was aspiring to own one of these things and my wife and I moved down to Florida and you know, the car culture here is tenfold what it is in New York. Really? Yeah. I thought it would have been pretty big up in New York. No, no. I mean, you see I mean, you would see the occasional tuner car. You’d see, you know, the occasional, you know, souped-up Mustang, but it wasn’t I mean, I think our first week down here, we saw our first Ferrari, you know, and I never seen one before. And I was like, what is that? When you when you were in New York, were you living in the city? I grew up in the city, right? So, that would explain it, right? It cost so much money to park and Yeah. There’s nobody has a car there, so that makes sense. Not feasible. Yeah. Um, so what was your first like sports car? A C63. Yeah. Okay. I I I saved up for that thing. Um I mean, I was intoxicated by the sound of that. I didn’t know anything about the handling. I didn’t care. Um you know, I just I wanted to hear that sound. I thought it was the coolest looking car. It had this like muscular boxy styling that I just thought was so cool. Um very German, you know. Uh so I bought that car actually in um Coral Gables and I drove home and I was just like on top of the world. I was like, “This is the coolest thing ever.” and immediately joined like MB World and was on there and chat with all the guys. I’m finally in the club, you know, and we did meetups and stuff and you know they were they were really excited that the that the AMG I would say click at that time was very much into car shows um street racing that kind of thing, right? Um no motorsport, you know, kind of influence. Um and but fortunately my purchase came with an AMG performance driving school. So, I got to attend it for free. I bought a ticket for my wife. The two of us went to Palm Beach International Raceway and uh Tommy Kendall and Shane Lewis were hosting the event. I had no idea who they were. I had to Google them when I got home. Um but they were legitimate as they could be and uh I got hot laps with them and got to see what a car can actually do. You know, it’s my first time ever truly breaking hard in a car. You know, I didn’t know you can like just slam on the brakes. I didn’t know the car would do that. And uh you know, it’s funny when we were talking on the phone, you know, just prior to the uh the show and you told me that story and the name Shane Lewis popped up again, I started thinking that Shane Lewis is kind of like the the Kevin Bacon Bacon of uh of motorsports, right? It’s there’s that of separation from Shane Lewis. I think he’s he’s our guy. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I Well, I mean, I used to think he lived at PBIR, you know, every time I was there. He was It was always, “Oh, there’s Shane.” You know, like in the stands or in in the garages or wherever. He’s a big deal now. Like he’s traveling a lot in Europe right now. Yeah. I mean, you know, I got to do he gave me a hot lap in a CLK Black Series. Um, and I mean, I genuinely couldn’t believe we were still on the track. The way he threw that thing through every corner. Um, looking at me the whole time. He’s like, “Hey.” You know, and I’m freaking out. you know, never been in a high performance car, let alone with a professional driver. Um, but it was fantastic and and he definitely could drive the wheels off. Man, you got your money’s worth riding with Shane. 100%. 100%. I mean, just the whole experience, it just was so eyeopening to what a car can do. You know, we watched the YouTube videos. I understand the cars straight line, they’re fast, you can floor it, but I had no idea the braking prowess of these things and the handling capabilities and it just opened my eyes to what driving really could be. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, we’ve gone through Okay, I don’t really care about cars, too. I am infatuated by cars. Hooked now. Now, you’ve done your your first track day with Shane Lewis. Like, talk about gateway drug, right? Well, now what? So, I was incredibly hooked and was like, I need to do this. I I literally on the drive home with my wife was like, I need to get back on track. Like, I don’t know anything about it, but I need to do this. Yes. Six years go by and nothing happens. Um, I don’t know if it was just, you know, I I just didn’t take the time. We were starting a business at the time, so I was quite busy, but um I just didn’t know how to get involved. I didn’t know what the next steps would be. And it was kind of one of those notions where it will present itself, you know, and I I’ll I’ll take advantage of it. But it just if I wasn’t going to do anything, it wasn’t going to happen. Um, and it just, you know, I joined the forums and I was talking to the AMG guys and I even said a number of times, let’s do a track day. And they’re like, dragstrip. And I’m like, no, no, like a track day. And they’re like, no, with turns and twisties, car show? No. Okay. Oh, okay. Um, no. So, it took a while to finally uh do the my first real track day. Um, and I had gotten into the exotic world briefly where I was interested in purchasing, you know, flashy cars and, you know, I was having fun with that. And I, uh, had purchased a McLaren 650S and I did, funny enough, how little I knew about cars. I did a NASA driving event, and I don’t mean NASA, the racing group, the landing strip, the three mile Yeah. runway. I know that they opened that up to to the I guess not the public, but people can rent it. No, he he it was uh a certain gentleman rents it like every 3 months. Um and I think it was limited to 20 or 30 cars. Um I had zero knowledge about prepping a car. Uh tire pressures. I I knew nothing. You just wanted to see how fast it would go. I wanted to see if I can go 200 miles an hour, you know, that was all I cared about, the big 200. And uh went there and surprisingly enough, there was no, you know, they’d ever checked over the car. There was no really just just hey, let’s see if you can go 200. Nobody tire pressure. Yep. No tire pressures, no tech sheet. Um they they if there was fuel in the car, no one knew, you know. It was just, hey, you’re here. Go run it. Um here’s three miles of tarmac. Good luck to you. They’re like they’re like buy the first cone, they’ll break you. Yes. Exactly. Don’t don’t die, please. Um and there were heavy hitters. I mean, there was a Bugatti Chiron. There was, you know, souped up GTRS. I mean, everything you could fathom. Um and no tech sheets, no no one checked over anything. And you know, I think back to that and I’m like, “Wow, that was sketchy.” I I the tires that came with the I was It was a used car. I don’t know, you know, who changed the tires and when last time the brakes were looked at, like I just drove it. Yeah. Um and I did hit 203. Uh Oh, jeez. Yeah. It’s just It’s on my YouTube channel. If you go to my YouTube page, you’ll see it’s it’s one of the first Oh, nice. We can do an overlay of that. Yeah. Yeah. You’ll see me in Does it show the the speedometer? Yeah. The overlay. And uh it was it was a cool event. But, you know, I didn’t know still, okay, there were some cool events that were presented, but I didn’t know how to get on the racetrack. How do I actually put myself on the track? Um, and through the exotic, owning an exotic car, there was um a gentleman who ran a charity event and for charity, he was like, “Hey, we’re doing a track day.” And I was like, “Oh, sign me up. Like, I need to get on track.” Yeah. Um, and it was at Homestead. We went there and there was a bunch of Ferraris, Lamborghinis, you I mean, everything under the sun. Um, and it was predominantly parade laps. Like nobody really wanted to push it, you know. I think the guy who organized the event had an ACR, Viper ACR. He was pushing it. Everyone else was just pedalling around and, you know, and it so it was it was also a nice introduction, but I still was left like wanting more. What What can I do? This is just not fun. Just kind of puddling around. I had no instructor. It was just, you know, go out and have fun. You paid for this charity thing. You have a couple hours to go out and do some things. just go do it, you know. And I was the only one out there for a while. I My wife actually went out a couple times by herself because there was no one going out on track. Like they rented the track and around the oval, right? No, we did we did the whole course. Yeah. Yeah. And uh but no, more people more interested in hanging out in the garages and showing off the uh their new paint job and Okay. how they wax their car. And so at some point you you decided I’m going to be more serious about this and that’s where you went to racing school. So yeah. Yeah. So, it’s 2019. Um, I I I realized exotic cars were just I love them. I appreciate them, but my my interest is really throwing a car on the track and just beating the snot out of it. Um, and see what we can do with it. Yeah. I actually traded in my McLaren for a Cayman GTS. Uh, of course he did, right? Like like every other wise human being, he naturally progresses to from whatever you whatever you had to an actual tool to do the job. I’m curious, let let’s talk a little bit about that. What was that big difference between the McLaren and then jumping to a GTS? Well, first the reliability. Um, my McLaren you would start with your fingers crossed and and I legitimately mean that. Like every time I started it, it was and not I mean this was the company was it was a 2015 so the company was kind of still, you know, newer in their their modern cars. Uh, so they’re still working out the kinks. I’m they’re probably better now. Well, maybe not. Let’s not jump to any conclusions. I’m giving them doubt, right? I mean, that’s very kind of you as a former owner, but that’s right. You know, I want to stay in their good graces in case, you know, um they want sponsor. Uh but um you know, it was it was stressful owning the car. I mean, I’m 5 foot seven and the car had this fantastic feature that when you open the door for someone your height, the seat would move itself back. That’s a really great feature. And it did it automatically. Um, I was in um where where uh Cape Canaveral doing that that runway event. Finished the event. Called my wife. I’m coming home. Open the door. The car this the seat moved back. Fantastic. Got in. Closed the door. Nothing happened. I’m I’m now trying to manually move the trick the the seat forward. Nothing happened. I am now stuck in a position for someone 6’5, 6’6. You can’t reach the back. I can’t reach. I’m like, is there a phone book? you know, like um so like that kind of I’m sure too. So I’m sure you’re you’re probably thinking this is embarrassing. Like I don’t want to ask somebody like, “Hey, I can’t reach the pedals.” I mean, I literally went into my suitcase and took every article of clothing and shoved it behind my back to to booster me forward so I can make that drive while I’m not just hanging on the steering wheel. Um but that sort of thing happens so often with that car um that it just little things little things. And what about driving it? what you know the the driving experience it was a fantastic car to drive um you know it felt like a true exotic it felt refined um it didn’t feel like you know because they had the 12C beforehand so it didn’t feel like a second generation McLaren um it felt like they had been doing this a while um it was a great car honestly when the car worked it was phenomenal I I loved it right um it was really comfortable uh if you put it in the sportiest settings it felt great felt nimble felt agile um compared to the the the Cayman GTS did you did you feel like okay the Cayman GTS is maybe a little more sluggish or not maybe quite more nimble you know what what year was the GTS was the 2.5 L turbo 2.5 turbo same car I have now fortunately that car had great low-end torque um which made up for any lack of horsepower honestly I mean that car it was funny because when I drove uh test drove that car I test drove a 2015 GTS which was naturally as aspirated and I sounded sounded better, but that was sounded fantastic. But I remember the the the poor salesman was really trying hard to move that 2015 even though it was it was cheaper, but I think they had had it for some time. And he was just like, “No, really get on it.” And I’m like, “I am.” And he’s like, “Well, no, no, shift to a lower gear.” And I’m like, “Dude, I’m in first.” Like, it’s just not going anywhere. Like, you really need to ring it out. Um, and the Porsche purists hate that 2.5 L so much that now the the 2015 is probably worth more than It probably is. That would not surprise me at all. Oh, I think it would be. Um, but I mean for so for me with my sole intention was getting into, you know, not necessarily motorsport but on track. Uh, that 2.5 was incredible. I mean that low in torque, it never felt anemic. Um, power is always there. Uh, I did downpipes from Soul. Um, that woke the thing up. I never tuned it, but just those downpipes, it was a whole another car. I mean, the way it revved out, um, you know, I I honestly never missed any high horsepower vehicle. I felt I felt totally, you know, satiated with that. So, you never looked back on the McLaren? Never. Never. Imagine that. I will say, I mean, the only thing I can point to about the McLaren was when I did drive it on track, I had no idea what I was doing. I would love to drive one now, right, having some experience and knowing a little more what I’m doing. So, that that is the only caveat. You know, I can’t speak to the the real handling capabilities of the car because I was just like, what am I doing? You you don’t know how much you were leaving on the table at the time because you weren’t getting everything. I was, you know, timing myself. I was just going out there looking for what does that flag mean? I didn’t even the charity event that I went to didn’t even discuss the flag. So, and you know, no idea. And at one point it was like the the hazard flag was out, you know, the red and orange. I’m like, what does that mean? That’s a happy flag. Yeah. Yeah. It means your It means the seat is stuck in the back position. You’re McLaren. That’s what it means. Yeah. Needed it. Nice. Uh tell me when you started You went to Lucas Oil Racing School. Yes. So, you know, I started doing track days in the Cayman. Uh loved it. Uh was was going 20 times a year at least. I mean, I just got when I go two feet in, I just go two feet. You got bit hard. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I brought the car to my shop and I was like, “Dude, you know, camber, alignment, get me, you know, uh, control arms, everything I could do to the car within reason. Let’s let’s do it.” Um, so I was all in. And I was loving it. I was absolutely loving it. And I attended um I it was I think it was an organization. I don’t even know if they’re still in business, but they did uh a tandem track day at Daytona with International GT. So, International GT was racing and we were there for the HDPD, you know, and I was I did my session. I was loving it, high on life. And I went up in the stands to watch the start of the first sprint race and the electricity in the air and watching the cars coming around, you know, the front straight and then the green flag drop and I was like, I need this. Like, what is you’re like, I want to do that. Yeah. And actually, I it’s funny. I called my wife again on the way home and I was like, I I need to race like, you know, I know it just started this tracking thing, but like now I felt the energy and I got to see it firsthand and I I need a piece of that. I need to see what So, I’m wondering um you mentioned your wife a couple times. H how has she I guess, you know, backed you up in into this crazy world of first cars and then tracking and then racing like So, yeah, my wife is been incredibly supportive. Um and she she’s sitting over there. um is actually a car girl herself. Um she’s beenund nearly 60 mph on the track, you know, not not in the street. Um she does some track days as well. She had done she had done some with me. Um she’s driven Ferraris, McLarens, you name it. Uh she’s gone out there. She actually during the AMG driving school, she was the only one drifting the SLS with point shooting. She was like, I’m gonna let the, you know, tail whack, you know. So, so she’s always understood, you know, from a personal perspective, understood the appeal. Yeah. Um, and then seeing, I think, my just love and passion, uh, you know, evolve, she really got behind it. Like, you know, you’re a maniac on the street, so at least you could channel that, you know, maybe not be a maniac all the time. And that’s something we talk about all the time. In fact, the last episode we really harped on that was trying to get people to stop racing on the street and get him on onto the track, which I laid down a challenge. And I said, “Any street racer out there that’s never done a track day before, if you go to the track and you beat Mike’s or my time, we’ll give you a free track day for the rest of the year.” We could throw Hal’s lap times in there because he’s right there, man. He’s a little bit faster than you and I. So maybe we should make, you know, if anybody ever beats that challenge and you owe him a free track day, we’ll just substitute your my lap time with his lap time. Okay. Yeah, if you you or I are not running, then it’ll be house time. Okay, that sounds like a good plan. Um, but it’s true. I mean, it’s it’s it’s such a great outlet, especially for people who would like to drive spiritedly and like to see what their car can do. I mean, it really it’s cathartic. I mean, by the time you’re done with the track day, I mean, I drive home, you know, relatively slowly after track day. I’m spent and I have no need to drive fast. I was just going, you know, 120, 130, you know, and that’s something that I think I’m going to we’re we’re going to want to have a a separate episode and talk about that topic. The fact that a lot of I would say high netw worth individuals really like the sport is because from Monday through Friday, if they’re running a business, multiple businesses, their brain just will not stop. and you go to the racetrack and you get inside that race car, there’s nothing else in there except the next turn. There certainly shouldn’t be anything in there other than what there’s no room for anything else. If there is, then you shouldn’t be out there in the first place. So, yeah, I think it’s very I think therapeutic and it’s it’s I almost I call it like a mental cleansing. Yeah. Oh, you you have to disconnect. So, certainly. Yeah. It’s I mean it’s a hell of way to disconnect. Right. Right. Well, because you’re right, you’re you’re so focused on the task at hand because I mean there’s a lot at stake as well. It’s not so much a disconnect. I don’t want people to get the impression of like, oh, I’m on vacation on the beach from reality. It’s more like you’re unplugging from one thing and plugging into something else, right? Yeah, that’s a better way to put it. Just just getting the blinders on and just uh you know, focusing. I think a good a good analogy would be if you’re watching TV and you got the picture and picture, but there’s like maybe 20 different picture and pictures like that. This is your brain, right? And when you go to the racetrack and you’re you’re racing, all of them go away and it’s just there’s just one picture and that’s all you can focus on, right? That’s essentially what it is. No, I love it. Okay. Um, you’ve driven a lot of different cars. Yeah. Trying to I mean, and that and that’s kind of part of my pursuit right now is to try to see in regards to racing, where do I want to go? What do I want to drive? Where do I want to commit? Um, so I’m actively trying to drive as much as possible. So te talk to me talk to us a little bit about the different cars that you’ve raced that you really liked, some that maybe were disappointment to you. Yeah. Um you can you can start with the most disappointing and then just end your story on Porsche just I mean you know I drove a BMW once. Um yeah, you know I got my start. So, to go back to your original question about the driving school, I first uh to pursue my racing license, I went through the Lucas Oil School of Racing, um which they have these little Formula Ray cars. Um I don’t know if they’re proprietary to them because they’re they’re a little different than the Formula Rays you would see on TV or uh in iRacing. Um but they’re intentionally kind of difficult to drive. Um teach you good car control. Um if you make a mistake, it’s exaggerated. Um you will spin. There’s no question. You could lock up the brakes. You will. Um, it’s like driving in the rain basically. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it’s not as pronounced as that, but it certainly, you know, it highlights uh, you know, bad habits, right? And so driving those is such a rewarding and frustrating experience because, you know, you think you’re great and then you just kind of spun through that turn and then you think you’re back on it and then you just overb broke and went into the grass and you’re like, man, like I thought I was good. Um, but it’s such a great tool. So, my start in there um and I did 16 races with them. I went through their school and then did their their racing uh program and it was fantastic. I mean, great competition. You learn a lot. Um you get humbled. Um and then you have days where you do phenomenal. Um but it was uh great to try those cars out and I learned that I would never want to own one of those. Um, so from there, uh, funny enough, my goal was always GT. And because I own a GT4 street car, I was like, you know, I I would like to go the Club Sport route. Um before I could actually commit to getting into a club sport, uh a gentleman by the name of Gustavo Yakaman reached out to me and said, “Hey, um we’re starting a master’s Formula 4 program at Homestead and it’s going to be in tandem with Farra and uh let’s uh let’s get you in an F4 car.” And I got to drive uh all of us uh from the Homestead driving club got to drive one and it was everything I ever expected it to be. It was um I mean you’re three inches off the ground, you know. Uh the brake is tremendously hard, but very little give and satisfying to get right. Um the acceleration is good. Um because the car weighs, you know, nothing, you know. Um the uh G forces you can obtain in in in the in hitting the apexes is beyond what you can comprehend. Um it’s full-on race car and uh very exciting to drive. So those those are So you mentioned you mentioned the the Formula 4. Let’s talk a little bit about that and I have that on my list of of things to go over. I’m going back and forth all over that. That’s fine. So, for people that don’t know, the Formula 4 is really made up of young kids. Young kids meaning 14 to I think 20 is the max. Somewhere around there. So, so Yakaman reached out to you. He was interested in doing a master’s program. Masters meaning older Yeah. individuals like us. And you would supposedly be running separately than the kids. Yes. So what happened? So you I really hope this story ends like that Seinfeld episode where Kramer is fighting like the little eight-year-olds in karate. Everybody see that? Oh, it’s fantastic. Now that we’ve ruined that one, buckle up. Yes, exactly. Buckle up. Um, so precisely that. So, uh, you know, he he called me and he’s like, you know, we’re presenting it to, uh, the gentleman from the Homestead Driving Club, which we, you know, we have 30, 40 members who are interested in trying out. Um, and trying out means just can you fit, you know, and you want to commit to doing this. Um, which everyone could. I mean, it really wasn’t an issue. Um, and he’s also inviting people from the outside. If I had anyone in mind, you know, and I like I have a pretty good rolodex of guys who track and might be interested in this. Um, no racing license required. Um we would kind of you know coach them through this whole thing really. Um yeah. Yeah. So like we were going to you know it was going to be kind of a learning process. Um but you had to be experienced. I mean you couldn’t just be you know first you know second track day kind of guy. You had to be pretty pretty much a veteran. Um and yeah and so he brought the cars out. So we did we got a test day. Everyone came in. Everyone I can’t wait to do this. This is amazing. I mean it was just very exciting you know. And and so he’s like, “Yeah, okay. We’re going to have at least 10 guys. Um we’re going to do a staggered start. So the young kids, just ignore them. The young kids will be going. They’re going to be fast. I mean, these kids have been in carts since they’re four years old. They’re going to get the green flag. You guys can come down, turn 10. Um then you’ll come across, you’ll get your green flag, and we’ll just go racing.” I’m like, “This is awesome.” You know, how great. you know, get to compete against fellow older gentlemen and, uh, you know, kind of test our metal and like get that experience of what it’s like to be a legitimate formula race car driver. So, um, I, you know, put my my name down right away without hesitation, expecting another eight or nine guys to do the same. Um, you know, I kept reaching out to Gustav, how’s it going? He’s like, oh, it’s great. You know, we’re really excited. We’re looking forward to this. Okay. two days before the race. Um, which was the one of the first races in the far calendar at at Homestead. This is this year. No, this was uh I think it’s 24. Yes. Last year. And um he’s like, “Yeah.” So, no one else signed up for the masters program. Ju just you. Yeah. For the masters. So, I’m like, “Okay, so I’m going to get a refund and bummer. You know, we’ll we’ll put me in something else, you know.” And he’s like, “No, no, no, no, no. You’re you’re still racing. you’re going knowing Gustavo, he’s not going to there’s no refund. No, no, no. So, so I’m like, “Okay, so why would you want a refund when you can go beat up on a 12-year-old?” Well, or or better yet, why get why get a refund while you can get beat up by 12? Exactly. I’m like I’m like, “Okay, so so how’s this going to work?” And he’s like, “Well, you’re going to beat you’re going to finish last. That’s how it’s going to work.” And Gustava, I love Gustavo. And he’s like, “Well, you’re going to win, right?” Of course. He sounds like a salesman. Like, uh, no problem. So, you know, you know, tentatively, I I went into the weekend. Um, the best was the the driver’s meeting, you know. So, I I they have an official separate driver’s meeting for the Formula kids and I go in there and, you know, looking around at the This is my my son’s age, you know, and the dads are all my cronies like they’re my age, you know, and I’m looking around. Dads are looking at you like, “Hey, man. What’s up? Which one’s yours?” I imagine your kid. I imagine like a preschool with a little chair and then here’s how in the little chair next to them. But in reality, they’re all bigger than me, you know, but um yeah, you know, and and uh so it’s definitely awkward, you know, first and a little weird and then and then incredibly intimidating because as you’re kind of, you know, getting ready for the meeting to start, I’m chatting with the kids, you know, at this point in time, had it dawned on you yet that you were going to be the slowest person. Oh, 100%. I mean, I I I fully understood that going into this, but then it kind of further cemented it when I’m talking to the kid next to me who’s up to my hip and he’s like, “Yeah, it’s my 10th year racing.” Right. Oh jeez. And I’m like, “Right, right.” He’s talking about spring rates and all kinds of stuff. And he started when he was five partying and it’s like he has, you know, 10,000 laps on this track and I’m like, “Oh, yeah.” And he he leans over to you and says, “Good luck to you out there, Hal, but if I see you, I’m going to put you on the wall.” Yeah. Just stay out of my way. Um, so it was it was incredibly humbling. Um, and so I, you know, I have to get my head around this, you know, and these kids have been driving these cars, some of them for a few years already. Um, and uh, you know, qualifying was was daunting, you know, because especially I’m still trying to get my head around driving this thing. It’s only it’s only the second time you’ve been in this car. I’ve been in this car and now, you know, we’re in qualifying and these kids are just, you know, flying by me like and there’s no point buys. There’s no, you know, courtesy is just they’re just going for it and and at 14, 15 years old, they’re like, that’s all they know. It’s just let’s just go, you know, red line. This reminds me of what the the scene in Tallaladega Nights uh when he’s going so slow and the other cars go and he’s like, “What was that? What was that? Were those the other cars?” Oh yeah. So much over on the radio. They’re like, “Are you okay? Is the car working? Is it is it is it functioning?” I’m like, “It’s fine. It’s just me.” Like I’m just getting my head around this whole thing. My goodness. Um but it ended up being a great weekend. I will say I kind of got to grips with the car by the final race. Um, which is a little little late, but uh and I set the fa fifth fastest time of the weekend. Oh, okay. There you go. You got sixth place. So, I was I was actually out of 16. So, I was I was pretty happy with where I was. Yeah. So, you were better than nine, 12, and 13 year olds. Yeah. Yeah. I rubbed it in their faces. I mean, yeah. Believe it. I got some rubber and smooshed like it was it was good. Well, the good news there is even if the five kids in front of you started talking smack, all you have to do is say, “Oh, yeah. Well, at least my mom isn’t driving me home from the track, right? I got a driver’s license. You got one of these? Um, so it was it was a great introduction. Um, unfortunately we still do not have a master’s class in that. Are you still running with them? You know, occasionally I do. So it’s it’s it hasn’t been intentional. Um, I went to I find because my like I said, my goal was to drive a club sport, a GT4 club sport. Um, and so I had spoke to David Touati and went to Sebring and I was like, I’m going to rent your club sport for the race. And you know, we went up there. This is only a few months after the the Formula 4 race and uh the clubs were broke of the practice. So we went out, transmission blew. Um okay, so I’m I’m going home. So I’m literally in line and my friend uh Ben Arche was racing. So I was like, I want to watch him qualify at least and hang around a little bit, have the hotel, but you know, I’ll probably end up packing up early. And I’m online to get something for lunch when Gustavo shows up and he’s like, “What are you doing?” And I’m like, “I’m here. I was here with the club sport, but that broke. So now I’m I’m actually going to go home. And he’s like, “You want to race Formula 4?” Oh, man. So I, you know, I have raced uh now total seven races with them. Really? Yeah. And uh have you gotten sort of the the wind beneath your your wings? You know, I haven’t stayed consistent with it enough to like really, you know, kind of become proficient with the Formula 4 because it does take rewiring. I mean, the car is so agile. So imagine Yeah. so capable that you know when I get back into So it’s funny because I did um actually I did one of the SLS events where I did the SLS event in my GT4 street car and then jumped into the Formula 4 to race and my street car felt like a Cadillac. I mean every time I got in I was like whoa why did she gain a,000 pounds with the body roll. Yeah. I mean, it was it was wild. And so to reorientate, you know, my my perception of everything was hard. You know, it’s and and that’s the thing. If you really want to make a go at at something like Formula 4, you got to be consistent. You got to be in there doing doing cuz it’s so different from any GT car you could ever race, you know? It’s night and day. I would love to join you out there in the Masters, but my guess is that somebody that’s 6’5 does not fit in a Formula 4 car. You know, Yeah. I don’t know. Right. No. Yeah. You can, you know, maybe just uh, you know, cut the pedal box and just put it outside of the car. Sure. Legs out, that might work. That’d be better than cutting my legs off at the shin. I mean, yeah. I mean, if you’re not willing to commit, you know, that’s up on you, you know. Okay. So, you’ve raced with little kids. Yeah. Yeah. You’ve raced with Far. You also raised Proud. You also race You like the way I frame that? I do. I do. You also race WRL. Yes. Which, uh, we talked about this. It’s an endurance series. Tell me about that. So, um, I signed up. I was very excited. Um, you know, I like the longer format. I’ve done a bunch of sprint racing and in formula and GT and I’ve done a few 2hour enduros with Farra. Loved it. I I just I need more of that. It’s It’s got more strategy involved. It’s not just, you know, go all out for 30 minutes, you know. It’s there’s strategy involved, pit stops involved. Really appealing. So, uh, a good buddy of mine, Ryan, uh, was coaching a WRL weekend and he’s like, “Hey, you know, we need a driver. Are you interested?” I’m like, “Yeah, where is it?” He’s like, “Dton.” I’m like, “Awesome. In June.” Okay. Um, has a cool suit. He’s like, “Got a cool system. Might have AC. We’re still working on that. It’s a E46 M3. Super well sorted. Uh, it’s like a contender.” Like, this car is one in WRL. It’s It’s a contender. I’m like, “Sign me up.” Yeah, super psyched. Um, it’s a 14-hour race, uh, one day. So, sometimes WRL will do endurance races and set them up over two days. So, it’ll be like six hours, seven hours. The second day, this was 14 straight hours, really. Um, Yep. So, it’s going to be uh quite long. Um, but how many stints did you drive? So, three of us um were supposed to do two hour stints. Um, which you know, how like two each? Two hours each. So, we go in for two, you’re out for four, in for two, out for four. Um, and uh, you know, we it it’s with a team, so we don’t have to do any wrenching ourselves. Um, which was that’s the only way I would do it also. Like, I will not go out there and wrench and drive. No, no, no. I mean, you’re so fatigued and and it’s it’s so draining uh mentally as well as physically because there is so much more going on than just driving fast because you want to be aware of the tires, you want to be aware of your fuel consumption, you want to be aware of pit stops, yellow flags, like there’s a lot to think about. Um, and then, you know, things going wrong, which they’re going to go wrong. You know, 14-hour race, a lot’s going to go wrong. Um, so ours our our situation started falling apart actually before the race. So, um, you know, they have a practice day on a Thursday and then they have, uh, qualifying and and and more practice on a Friday and then the race. Um, I was like, should we do the practice on Thursday? And my coach is like, no, no, no, no. You’re going to get plenty of time on Friday. You’ll have like so many hours in the car and then during the race, you’re going to be in the car at least six hours. Like, you you’ll be fine. I’m like, okay. So, we skip the Thursday practice. Um, Wednesday night I get a text message that the M3 we’re supposed to drive the motor blue on the dyno because they require dyno results um to class the car and Okay, again situation are are we out? Am I getting my money back? Are we going to put it forward? Where else are we going to race? No, no, no. We’re borrowing uh a BMW 235i street car converted to race car, but it’s it’s good. It’ll work. You know, might not be as competitive as the other one, but you you’ll be happy. We’ll finish the race. Yeah, exactly. So, I’m like, “Okay.” So, we show up. Uh Thursday, they had a great day. Uh I didn’t We didn’t run, but you know, Thursday was a beautiful day. A lot of practice time for the people who did run. Friday, I’m like, “Okay, we’re get a lot of practice in on this car.” Lightning. Um and Daytona, if you’re not familiar, has really advanced lightning detection, and they will not run if there is lightning within a million miles. You know, it’s it’s it’s because of the corner workers. Yeah. and and I get it, but it’s it’s so sensitive and they for whatever they detect further out than like NASA, you know, so pretty much the entire day was just waiting. So, no practice. No practice. I got in the car for one practice and I was in it for I think three laps and during those three laps, I got to know the car this much. It was just, you know, I I knew where the pedals were. 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We’re we’re getting um you know, cool suits, not working. It’s intermittent, you know, like, okay. Um you know, we’ll we’ll work it out. And and the AC’s blowing hot air. I mean, like hot air. This is summer in Florida. It’s 96 degrees, you know, 120 130 in the car. Oh god. So So okay. So, I’m getting ready to get in the car. I’m already like, you know, a little nervous about the heat, but I’m putting ice in my my my suit. I’m still wearing the cool suit because they said it’s intermittent. So, sometimes it works and it’s nice. As long as it doesn’t work. I get in the car, uh, does not work. Not at all. Uh, the AC is not just blowing hot air. It is just engulfing the cabin and hot air. It is blowing on me with intention. You can’t turn it off. You can’t because another issue with this car was we were having some overheating. Overheating. So you have to blow it out of there. Yeah. So we had to blow all that that hot air in our face. Oh my god. You know the worst. Sounds like a fun sun. Yeah. So and and it was just it was just brutal. So we’re you know we’re we’re I’m in the my two-hour stint. Um I make it through it just barely. You know starting to see black spots but make it out of the stint. Okay. Switch drivers. Next to go. Um then uh my turn comes again four hours later. I’m like, “Okay, we’re and we qualify P16 and we’re now in P9. Okay, we’re we’re catching the group. We’re doing well.” Um I get in for my second stint and I’m already overheating getting into the car and I intentionally put ice up. I mean, I any crevice I could pack ice, I did. Well, the black spots, just to quickly interrupt you, you’re already starting to suffer from heat exhaustion. Yes. And you’re not recovering for at least 24 hours. No. No. And you took a 4-hour break, right? Okay. And so, we’re already in bad shape. Bad shape. And And mistakenly, I didn’t even sit in a car cuz, you know, Daytona, there’s no place there’s no rest bit, you know, unless you get into a car or a trailer or something. And I I made the mistake of being social instead of getting in a car and blasting some AC. So, I it was just it was bad bad decision after bad decision. So, I get in the car. Um it’s bad. I mean, I’m I’m I’m doing well enough where my times are consistent. We’re one of the faster guys in our class. Um but I’m starting to suffer and I’m starting to feel some stomach cramping. I’m starting to feel fatigue. I could feel the headache coming. And I radio in and I’m like, “Yeah, like guys, uh safety is now a concern. I I might need to get out of the car.” And they’re like, “Well, your replacement driver is in the bathroom.” Um, so can you just can you just go out for a little longer? I’m like, “Okay.” So, you know, force it a little longer, a little longer to the point where now my stomach is fullon cramping. I am full in the gulf of of heat stroke. And I’m like, “Guys, I need to pull in.” They’re smartly the the crew chief is like, “Get in. Just get in.” So, I pull in. I can’t even get out of the car. Fortunately, one of the crew members that the mechanics was a a paramedic uh pulled me out of the car and stripped me to my underwear on pit lane. Like literally on like just ripped my clothes off, packed me with ice, you know, liquid IV, all that stuff. You must have looked pretty bad if you determined that. He said I had no color at all. He was like it you can he’s visibly he’s like you were not well. I’m like great. Okay, so that matches how I was feeling. So thank you for that confirmation. That’s my insides or my outsides. Yeah, great. Um, so I get in a car this time and I just blast the AC and they’re like, “Well, you have a break now because the car broke down.” So the the car is now overheating. So they park the car and they’re like, “We’re going to work on it.” And then we have everyone else going, so you have some time to kind of recuperate. So I sit in the car, blast the AC. Um, we were out of the race for about 45 minutes while they replaced hoses and, you know, whatever. Um, I wish we we we replaced the AC, but we didn’t. Um, tried to get the cool suit system working. Nope. It was just the wiring all need to be redone. Um but finally we got it working. Car went out. Guys are doing awesome. My teammates are killing it. They’re they’re moving back up. I think we’re we’re now in eighth or seventh. Um it’s my turn to get in. They’re like, “What do you think?” I’m like, “Listen, I I feel okay. I feel good enough to drive. I’m just I’m not going to be doing hot laps. I’m just going to be consistent and and doing it.” I get in the car again, packing. My wife’s like pouring ice down my shirt and she’s like, “Don’t die.” I’m like, “Okay, go out.” It’s good advice. Yeah. Yeah. So, first hour, then we have pit. I felt fine. I really I think I got into like a zone and got into a rhythm and I was doing actually my best times uh of the day. Um we were we were actually one of the fastest guys on track in our class at that point. I was feeling good. Um went out for my last 45 minutes of the stint. Um we got a yellow flag. Okay, cool down. It was nice and nice. Um, wimp green. I started going. They’re like, “Two more laps.” I’m like, “Okay, you know, two more laps. I could do this.” I’m going through turn one, a GT4, um, is kind of going through turn one with me, but he’s definitely more in my quarter section in the rear. So, I’m thinking he’s going to let me go through the chicane and then just easily get around me because that would make the most sense at this point because, you know, I had track position. Um, he’s not. He’s He’s still going at it. We’re We’re coming through. We’re still turning, you know, my steering wheel still turned and he’s just moving in closer and closer to me, indicating, hey, I’m going. I’m like, oh god. So, I lifted and I think it was part of his fatigue and all that. And the car started rotating, right? So, I in my stouper was just like, “All right, I’m I’m losing the rear, so I’m going to go back to throttle a little bit to move shift the weight to the rear so I can get a little grip.” And I think I gave too much throttle and I just lost control. spun, hit the wall, nothing too crazy. Bounced off, facing the wrong direction. Okay, not good. Go to restart the car. Nothing. Like, okay, I’m now stuck. This is now my worst nightmare. This is turn two. Turn one. Like, it was right after, you know, it’s a it’s blind, you know, concrete wall. It’s turn one. And I’m facing the wrong way. And I see the flag bearer and it’s a green flag and and I’m literally waving. I’m pulling the brights. I know they’re not working. The headlights are gone. But I’m I’m flashing the brights. I’m screaming. I’m doing everything. You know, Cup cars are are going into turn one into the breaking zone at well over 160, 170. Right. So, and I’m acutely aware of that. And cars are just flying. They’re coming and they’re last minute. You could see from the language of the car. Oh, you see their eyes? Cars are going left, cars are going right, and I’m sitting there, and all I could do is be a passenger waiting to get hit, right? Just sit there with your eyes closed at that point in time and hope for the best. All of a sudden, two prototypes come around turn one, and the prototype in front is clearly watching his mirrors because editor behind him is is trying to get him and last minute he moves and the prototype just nails me. Oh my. Head to head. We just we just kissed headtohead. Um he said he was going about 80. I have no idea. Um and that was I I mean I thought it was over. I was like that that’s it. you know, that lights out, you know. Yeah. Um, fortunately, I I never I was conscious the whole time. It hurt like hell. Um, I never felt pain like that all all over. Just jarring, huh? It was It was so brutal. Um, was your wife there? So, my wife was there. She was watching from the stands and she’s quite familiar with with racing and she saw there was a red flag, but she didn’t see the the incident. She didn’t know it was you. She knows me. So she was like booking it to Pit Lane to find out because she she knew my stint was over. So she was like, “Okay, it’s a red flag.” So they’re just stopped. But when he when it’s green again, he’s coming right in. Yeah. So she’s like, “I’ll meet him with with, you know, liquid IV and all that stuff.” Cuz she was just more concerned about my dehydration and heat stroke than anything else. She goes, she’s going down pit lane and she sees the crew and she’s like, I can see the look on their face. Oh man, you were involved. And so she immediately is like, “What happened?” And the guys were really nervous because they knew it was a big impact. They knew it was bad. And they were like, “I don’t know. Ask him.” And they kept passing the boat. And finally the uh the owner of the team was like, “We’re going to the hospital.” And she’s like, “Okay.” And he’s like, “Follow me. We’re going.” So they went to the hospital. Um which it was one of those things where, you know, the the ambulance drivers, they pulled up, they were so upset that they were never yellow flags. Um, so they were screaming. It’s so funny because I’m like I’m in writhing pain like mostly my So one thing about endurance racing, we’re putting each other in and out of the sea. So the belts weren’t as tight as they should have been, right? So when I got hit and the impact, it moved my manhood into the wrong position. Right. So I was in tremendous pain for more than one reason. Oh my god. Yeah. My stomach hurt, my neck hurt, my head hurt, everything hurt. Just head to toe pain. And the ambulance drivers were so upset that there was they were yelling at me. They didn’t throw the yellow flag. I’m like, I don’t care. You know, can we please go to the hospital? And well, and they asked, they’re like, “Do you need to go to the hospital?” I’m like, “I don’t know.” I was like, “That” and they were like, “That was a big impact.” I’m like, “What’s your assessment?” You know, like you guys are This is the expert. The hell you asking me for, you know? And they were like, “Yeah, you could have,” they’re like, “Where does it hurt?” I was like, “Everywhere.” They’re like, “You could have internal bleeding.” I’m like, “Great.” Like, “Let’s just go.” Sounds bad. So, fortunately, I was able to get out on my own accord. Um, which they did relate to my wife like he stood and walked. She was like, “Sweet.” Um, but you know, yeah. So I went there, went triage, had that whole embarrassing thing where they just rip your clothes off for five. It’s like a audience of people waiting there, you know. Um, we need to have a a segment where we bring the wives in and get their take on like what was going on. I was I was just getting ready to say the very same thing. And the good news is we get cookies when she comes. That’s right. You guys are welcome. Two reasons to have her on. Hey, listen. We only have 7 minutes left and I love the story, but I want to get through as many of these as possible. We’re going to go through rapid fire questions. I I have one quick followup for Kyle. Have you gone back to endurance racing after that event? Well, it just happened in June. Um, so I’m I’m still recovering and I had some afterwards. So, but yes, I will. I mean, I I certainly will. I’m already racing in a couple weeks. So, yes, I I will be back. All right, rapid fire questions. Uh, most of these are going to just be for Hal because they involve racing. Okay. Um, I’ll just sit here and eat my cookie then. All right. 10 questions less than seven minutes. All right. I’m ready. If racing disappears tomorrow, what would fill the void? Oo, that’s tough. Um, probably swimming, believe it or not. Really? Yeah. I was a competitive swimmer and I did it up until I was 30 and I would probably do that again. Okay. Number two. If kids are fearless, what’s the adult racer’s secret weapon? Intimidation. That sounded like a great answer, even if you didn’t. That’s just not real. Um, I think I think just poise, honestly. Um, the kids will just kind of send it and we’re a little more reserved and I see a lot of incidences that are easily avoidable. Okay, number three. If you’re a bad driver, what’s the go-to car to mask the lack of skill? Mhm. Feel like he’s already got one in mind. Um I Well, I’ve seen a lot of Corvettes. Um I knew it. Yeah. With that that similar affliction. All right, number four. Um what’s more dangerous, overconfidence or underpreparedness? Interesting. I I would say overconfidence would get you in trouble um a little quicker. Um because at least you know if you’re you know not overconfident and you have something go wrong at least you’re a little more aware and uh know your your limits. All right. Uh number five. What ruins more potential racers? Ego, money, or fear? Um ego. I’ve had more instances with ego. Yeah. Personally. Yeah. Yeah. Guys that just didn’t check it and tried things that were just stupid and Yeah. and you see it a mile away, you’re like, “Oh, he’s he’s going to try to make that pass and I’m just going to check up and he’s just go in the grass.” And and interestingly enough, it’s probably the same answer for for HBD, what we do. Yeah. Right. Yeah. It’s always ego that that gets in the way. Yeah, that’s true. All right. Next question is for both of you. If you had to raise blindfolded with someone as your eyes, who would you trust? Someone we know personally or could be anybody. You pick him out of the sky. Yeah. Whoever. Dude, Lewis Hamilton. Good answer. Anyone? Yeah. What about you, Mike? Uh, yeah. I’d say being a being an IRL homie, even though I’m a Pensky fan, it pains me to say this. Scott Dixon. Like just the most consistent. Been doing it for 40 years at that level if you include Carding. The guy is just unbelievable. Yeah. All right. Uh, what’s more embarrassing? Running out of talent or running out of gas? Well, well, that’s happened to me in an endurance race. Well, yes, actually. Yeah. Yeah, hopefully not at the same time. I I was leading an endurance race by two laps um in an Aston Martin GT4 and we ran out of gas. Oh no, I had to do the the toe of shame and it was really embar and still got podium. Still got the third place on the podium and they you know David Touati had to announce that you know. So what’s worse? That was really embarrassing. We’re running out of gas. Yeah. Just because it’s so easily avoidable you know simple just but we but we’ve se we’ve seen that multiple times even in HPDE. Oh yeah. Somebody runs out of gas and happy hour at the end of the day. Yeah. Because you’re just happy to go out there. You’re like, “Oh, it’s my turn.” Don’t even pay attention to that fuel gauge. Yeah. No. Who needs that? All right. Number eight. Which stays with you longer? A win you didn’t deserve or a loss you couldn’t explain? I will say uh the win I didn’t deserve. I’ve had that. Yes. And and it didn’t sit right. I didn’t like that. I figure Yeah. Sits kind of heavy. Yeah. All right. Mid this this one’s right up your alley. I don’t know why. Mid race. Would you rather have a brake fade or a bowel fade? Rather have I mean I probably a bowel fade just cuz I’m I’m still able to stop the car then and get off. I would just let it I mean you know and send me the bill. I I’ll have the car clean. You’re disgusting. Hell. All right. Number 10. Would you would you rather uh race fearless and short-lived or cautious and longlasting? Oh, cautious and longlasting. Yeah. At my age. Yeah. 15 years ago. The other way around, but Well, you’re also not getting paid enough for the former. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, paid in cookies, so Right. Well, right. And you, my guess is you get those regardless of where you finish. So, Right. Right. All right. How we’re going to move on to our last segment, which is the guest challenge. This is where you get to challenge one of your friends, two of your friends actually, to come on to the podcast as guests. So, if you want to look into your camera and lay down the challenge, I think a great guest, I don’t believe you’ve had him, uh, Terry, um, in SL4. Okay. I think he would be phenomenal. Um, and Ben Arche, um, who is a newbie to tracking and racing the last couple years and is is doing it, and I I would love to hear his story. Well, there you go. the the challenge has been laid down by Howal. If you’re interested in coming on the podcast, definitely go to the website. It is off theracingline.com and uh let us know when you want to come in. That is all the time that we have for today. It’s been awesome talking to you. You got some great stories. I think we’re going to have him back. We need to have Yeah, I want to talk more. There’s I kid you not, there’s like two or three pages worth that I didn’t even get to. And again, we have to have his wife on at the same time. I think that would be great. Yeah. Is that something that you would be interested in? All right. Well, she’s she’s got some time to think about it. All right. Until next time, remember, everything interesting happens off the racing line. See you guys next time. [Music] My head down my name pressure made a diamond out of me [Music] and peace to save my conf where my story begins. Voices screams break the cones the highway focus on the next turn. This ain’t rock [Music] where my story begins.
